Navigating Career Passions and the Art of Authentic Living: One Women's Guide to Professional and Personal Fulfillment

Join us as I, Jenny, invite my dear friend, Abi onto the Steel Rose podcast, where we peel back the layers on the complexities of carving out a career path that resonates with your soul. Imagine being at a career crossroads, the anxiety-inducing buzz of the unknown humming in the air—Abi and I have been there. We discuss the whirlwind of early career development, recounting tales of professional challenges and the struggle to maintain serenity amidst workplace storms. Abi imparts her sage advice for young women: seize learning moments, venture outside your zone of comfort, and embrace the personal evolution that comes with each twist and turn on your professional road.

This episode isn't just about climbing the career ladder; it's a journey into the heart of what ignites your passions. Abi and I reflect on the joy of unearthing new interests that could steer your professional voyage in exciting, uncharted directions. We empathize with the heavy anchor of student loans and the societal pressures that hustle us along conventional career paths. Our stories weave through the fabric of these shared experiences, stitching in pieces of wisdom and the reminder that sometimes the road less traveled can lead to destinations more fulfilling than we ever imagined. And for those needing that extra nudge to take the leap, I share my own leap into podcasting and recommend Gary Vaynerchuk's "Crush It" for a dose of inspiration.

Ending on a soulful note, Abi and I open up about the critical practice of nurturing one's happiness through self-care and setting boundaries. The episode is a heartfelt exploration of the transformative power of self-reflection, self-advocacy, and the courage it takes to step away from toxic relationships and societal expectations. We get real about the importance of support systems that respect your journey toward self-fulfillment and the joy that blossoms when you live authentically. It's a rallying cry for anyone questioning if they're truly living or merely existing: to rise, seek out what brings you joy, and craft a life that resonates deeply with who you are, in the office and beyond.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

Hi everybody, welcome to Steel Rose's podcast. This podcast was created for women, by women. You're hearing Jenny. Today I'm hosting this episode and I have a very special guest. I have my friend Abby here with me today. Abby, welcome to the show.

Speaker 2: 0:16

Thank you, Jenny. I'm super excited to be here. Oh, of course. Oh sorry, I messed up your intro.

Speaker 1: 0:24

Oh my God. No, you're okay. Abby and I met, let's see, like a year ago, virtually. Is that how it is? I think right, I think it was about a year.

Speaker 2: 0:35

Yeah, I think you joined. No, I think you joined like about a year and a half. I think you joined in like August, like August 2022, right, yeah.

Speaker 1: 0:42

Yeah, it's been like a year and a half. So Abby and I have known each other. We well. We met first professionally and we worked together for about a year, for about a year or so, and over the course of that year I had the great pleasure of getting to know Abby and Abby I'm going to talk about you to your face right now. So when I, when I first met Abby, I I will admit I was not sure if you liked me or not, and I think we were just trying to test each other out, which is totally fine because I've gotten pretty.

Speaker 1: 1:14

When I was in my youth, younger years, I got pretty consistent feedback that I had RBF and a lot of people up front were like we're not really sure about Jenny.

Speaker 1: 1:26

But you know, over time, as we got to know each other, one of the most wonderful and valuable things that I found with you was that you were very much almost like a North Star, and and by in in saying that, I mean you know there were instances where I would be stressed out about something or frustrated or just like worried, and I would literally say to Abby like hey, like do you just have a couple of minutes?

Speaker 1: 1:56

Like can I just run something by you and Abby had this, this calming, which you're like are you crazy? But Abby always came in was like this is the logical and calming way that you can handle this, or this is, these are the tools that you can use to help get yourself through whatever the scenario is, and I always found that really wonderful and I just wanted to tell you that, like you know, that was always something that I was like well, abby will help me out here. Like, let me, let me talk to her and see if she has any tips for me to get through this anxious situation or get through this anxiety. So thank you for that, and I'm going to give you some space here to just introduce yourself to the listeners and let them know a little bit about yourself.

Speaker 2: 2:45

Yes, yeah, I'm Abby, as you said. Yes, I have a professional background with Jenny. We worked in the same industry. I also have a background in public health. I got my MPH back in 2019. So that's sort of my academic area of study and my focused area and kind of where I come and approach a lot of the ways I look at the world, which I'm sure will come out in this conversation we're going to have. So, yeah, I consider myself kind of an interesting individual, at least in the sense that my career has gone in a lot of different directions and I never really planned to be where I am, I guess, but I'm enjoying it and I'm just rolling with it. And, yeah, I don't know what else. If you anything else specifically you want me to touch on, If anything else specifically you want me to touch on.

Speaker 1: 3:32

Well, I like that. You basically just said like you didn't really plan to be exactly where you are but you kind of just rolled with it. So you've had like, because I know when I met you I didn't know about the MPH and I didn't know you had a background in public health. I didn't know you know all the education background you had. And it's interesting because Abby was like the secret, Like she had like the secret in her back pocket, because I always had a sense with Abby that I was like she's got something and I don't know what it is, I can't put my finger on it, and you do have this great knowledge and you do have this great knowledge.

Speaker 1: 4:12

What I think that I found the most guidance with you was when we would talk about anxiety and dealing with situations that are unpleasant, to be perfectly honest with the listeners. Like there's times professionally when you have to have unpleasant discussions or you're put in situations where you feel awkward about having to deal with something, and Abby always gave me really great tips in that area. So, Abby, professionally speaking, if there was advice you could give to listeners, especially like young women coming up in any of their industries. But women coming up in corporate America, their jobs, are trying to get their professions like kicked off. What would you say to them? Like coming to the table, they're new and they maybe don't have a ton of work history. They're nervous about starting their new job. What are your thoughts there?

Speaker 2: 5:02

Oh yeah, that was definitely me not too long ago, so I relate to that heavily. But yeah, I think in in the course of my very short career so far. I think the most important thing I can give is just really be willing to learn and be willing to dive in, especially on things you don't have experience with. I think it's totally okay, like when you're new in your career no one expects you to know everything, like you are still an intern in some ways. You're there to learn and you can really leverage that to your advantage, because you can use that to get experience in a lot of different areas or on a lot of different projects and really just having an open mind, even if something especially if something doesn't seem initially like really attractive to you think I learned the most about myself when I took on projects or were in situations where it wasn't something I would have chosen for myself, necessarily. But everything you don't like leads you closer to finding something you do like, and I think that's really important when you're younger in your career and you don't know what's all out

Speaker 2: 6:03

there and you might have gone through college and applying for your first job with a very specific vision of what you wanted your first job to look like or what you want your whole career path to look like.

Speaker 2: 6:14

Um, and I think it's kind of cliche.

Speaker 2: 6:16

But when you look back at like the career histories of a lot of really successful people, like even Oprah Elon Musk as much as I am not really a fan like basically every single person outside of like politics has a non-linear career path and have done a lot of really interesting things, and I think you can just really leverage that to your advantage and just being open to learning, being open to trying new things and also just being a delight to work with, just really trying to be a team player.

Speaker 2: 6:48

And I think another thing I'm kind of going all over the place here, but another thing is to like it's okay to like ask for help and flag when you have a question or you don't understand something, and really trying to have a mentor or foster a really strong relationship with like a supervisor, someone else in your company, someone in your industry, maybe not in your company the more people you can sort of have like in your corner, so to speak, that you can bounce ideas off of and talk about situations with, like you and I did, jenny, like I know, you were also super helpful to me and all the situations.

Speaker 2: 7:21

So I really can't thank you enough for your feedback. I think it's a really good example of women supporting and building each other up. Sometimes we had no idea what was going on or we were both super angry and couldn't think straight and even then we were like, okay, we got to calm down and think about how we're going to rationalize this. But it was just nice to be in it together and, yeah, I think, lean on your community for your support and just be open minded.

Speaker 1: 7:47

I think that you touched on a lot of really important things and we don't we don't talk a lot on this podcast about like the, the beginning, basically, like a lot of the guests that come on are in like the midstream or they're like scaling and they're doing really wonderful and we hear that. But the beginning steps and and abby had said something really important here and very valuable is that, like you know, there are, if you look at, most highly successful people. They hear track history is all over the place, like they did try a bunch of different things. They did try a bunch of different things. They did investigate a bunch of different pathways.

Speaker 1: 8:32

I have only professionally well, I've always worked in medical and then after college I always worked in med comms. That was kind of like that was it. I did logistics for a med comms agency and then I was just med comms and I got to a point. I think I was like when I was in my mid twenties, mid to lates, where I remember being like I don't know if this is for me, I'm not sure that I want to do this, but I had gone so far and I didn't want to take a pay cut and people I was trying to get out of it and I started interviewing for other roles and people were like what are you? And the interviewers were literally saying to me like what are you doing? You have all this work history here, like just go back to what you were doing. And so I ended up just right back in it. But you know, now I have the podcast. This is not like my outlet, but I do, but I do encourage people like Abby had a really great point to where she said like you know, nobody, nobody expects you to know everything.

Speaker 1: 9:23

So if you're starting out in your career, even if you're in the first five years of your career, that's still considered starting out. Like you are still learning. Because for every, for every I've been at nine agencies and in 17 years and for every agency it always took me about a year or so to learn the ropes at that agency and then it would take me another year to be great at my job. And then by the third year I was like, okay, where am I at? Like, where am I going from here? It takes time, it takes a lot of time and it's okay to, part of the way through your career, say like you know what. I'm not really sure that I want to do this, like I'm not sure that this is the right path for me, so I think that's really valuable that you're getting that kind of um that kind of feedback.

Speaker 2: 10:16

Yeah, I'm glad. Yeah, I really do think. Yeah, and I guess I am still at the start of my career, cause I don't even think I've been in the working world for five years. Got my first job what yeah? Mid 2019. So, coming up on five years, here soon.

Speaker 1: 10:25

Oh yeah, you're getting there.

Speaker 2: 10:26

Yeah, I still feel like it getting there. It's still a lot to learn and yeah, I feel like I have people ask me this a lot of their like do you want to stay in the role you're working in or in the industry you're in forever and it's like, well, I don't really know, I could be a totally different person when I wake up tomorrow. So I'm kind of just playing it day by day and I think that's like really the most generous thing I can do for myself is when you can be too totalitarian or like too predictive. Then I think God kind of just laughs on your plans and shake things up just for fun, and those are great growing and learning experiences. But really just having an open mind to the possibilities can really, I think, can reduce stress and anxiety kind of a lot.

Speaker 1: 11:11

I think it's I've said for quite some time, and now even to like my little guys, like one of my kids said to me some the other day something about going to college and I was like, well, you don't have to go to college anymore. I was like I'm just saying. Like when I was growing up, it was like, oh, you go to college. Like that's it, like that is the only path you can take. And I'm like, nowadays you can do so many other things.

Speaker 1: 11:34

And I think that there's a huge problem where we're forcing 18 year olds, 17 year olds and 18 year olds to pick a major in college, stick with that major and then get jobs with it. Like, by the time when you graduate high school and then you graduate college, like you are a totally different person. And then, even when you graduate college, in five, five years, five years from then, you're even more of a different person because your mind is growing and changing and who you are is changing you. There's no way. I mean, granted, I wanted to be a creative writer when I was in high school, so now I'm getting to dabble a little bit in that, but like, yeah, you're doing it.

Speaker 1: 12:16

But it's like you know, we're forcing our youth in America to make these major decisions and major life decisions, but you haven't even really discovered yourself yet. So I think it's really wonderful that you're being so open and that you are willing to look into things and research things. One of the big things that Abby had impressed me with several times over was your willingness to take stuff on and be like well, let me research this and dig into the details and see what it is and put together all this information and, you know, figure this out. And it would be for like small things, big things, whatever, and that is really where you're going to learn the most. Like even I just you'll hear by the time this episode airs.

Speaker 1: 13:05

This other episode would have aired already, but I just did a whole. I just recorded an entire episode on like how to podcast and like how to put you know if you want to start in it, like what are you going to do and what are the steps. And when I decided to podcast, I literally spent like two months researching how to do this and playing with it and checking out all the different platforms and, like you know, how do I pull the audio file down from my recording platform and pull it over here and you know it it. I could have at any point said you know what. This isn't for me. This is annoying, like I don't, I'm not into it, but I love it. I love production. So this is like my jam, but like that's an expansion and you are embracing that, you know, and in your, in your moment right now, like yeah, you're working professionally, but you're embracing the fact that you can expand into different things yeah, for sure.

Speaker 2: 13:58

No, yeah, and I I love going on those weird little rabbit holes like, where you kind of just forget everything else exists and get like a one-track mind. There's definitely things that I have to, like I'm putting them off because I'm like, oh no, I'm, I'm gonna get into a rabbit hole on this, so I need to wait until I have like the time and the space and the energy to do it. But yeah, I do think being able to like commit to something and really focus and specialize just to learn is good, and I think that can look like different things for different people, but yeah, for me it's definitely come up in that one area and being able to try things out without sort of like marrying myself to it forever.

Speaker 1: 14:35

Yeah, no, I think that that's a. I think it's a smart approach and I think a lot of people probably would have benefited from that. My husband and I talk all the time about people that we know that went to college and are doing nothing with their degrees, and I'm talking to people that went.

Speaker 1: 14:51

I mean, these are people that went to like heavy schools, they have their masters, like. These are people that are like educated people but they're like doing nothing you know to do with their degrees. And it's just educated people but they're like doing nothing you know to do with their degrees, and it's just. It's such a burden financially on people to go to higher education and then to not work in their field and not be making that salary. It's like mind-blowing. It's mind-blowing. I just, you know, I go to the financial part because I just got it. I'm 40 and I'm still paying my student loans, so it's like, yeah, yeah that's a whole other can't orange.

Speaker 2: 15:26

It's like a whole other whole other situation I get.

Speaker 1: 15:30

I get very jealous of um other countries with her with this kind of stuff because, like, health care and education in other countries is like totally, totally different. Like it's, it's, this is yeah. But we do the burden like when you graduate from college and and I'm fortunate because I I didn't have to pay for for all of my education but I have family members and friends that graduated and they owe hundreds of thousands of dollars and it's like how are you ever supposed to pay that back?

Speaker 2: 16:02

Like you know, yeah Right, I'd break out in hives when I hear about how much money some people owe, like I would not be sleeping at night, and it's one of those things where I hope all debt gets forgiven and paid back. But if it doesn't, I mean some people are going to be paying it off for a very long time yeah, I have friends who are working to get the um, the forgiveness, but still that's not guaranteed. They make it really difficult and has to be processed and everything.

Speaker 1: 16:33

So, yeah, whole crisis hence me being telling my kids like, well, you don't have to go to college, guys like um which I very firmly believe that they don't um, I do think that there's a lot of pathways out there that don't require it. Um, one of my favorite people, um, is um, which Abby you probably know this because you see me on LinkedIn all the time but um, gary Vaynerchuk is like and he goes by Gary V he's like, hands down, one of my favorite people to follow, and the only reason why not the only reason why, but a huge portion of the reason that I do follow him is because I had met him and knew him way back when he was just managing his dad's wine shop and I worked at the bank next door and I handled the deposits Like. I was the person who did that. And I remember a couple of years later, like after college, and I remember somebody said to me like hey, you should check out this book, crush it. And it's by this guy, gary. And I was like, oh, like, let me read it. And I was reading through it and it was the Gary from the Wine Library in Summit, new Jersey, and I was like, oh, do I? Is this the guy and I was like no frigging way, he wrote this book. And so I read the book and I was like this is amazing. By the way, like strong recommend if you're like getting your legs and like trying to figure stuff out for yourself, crush, it is like an amazing book. Um, that was one of my very first like professional books that I read. Um, really strong recommend for it. But I read it and I was like, oh, this is awesome.

Speaker 1: 18:15

Like he wrote a book cool and then, like he's slowly gained momentum over the years and now he's basically reinvented himself.

Speaker 1: 18:22

This is a person that was running a liquor store like, literally, this is what he was doing and he took it and he just kept leaning into his passion, which, by the way, lean in is another professional book that I read early in my career. These are all like my faves. But you know, these people like, he really just just like took his passion and he kept working on it and he kept turning it into different things. And now he's this media guy and he does all these really cool interviews. Like if I could ever be interviewed with him, like my life would be complete, like that would literally be like you know, it's folks like him that like just tried stuff and they just tried what they were passionate about, what was making them happy, and it led him down a whole other path and I think that that's really important for people to really recognize now, because you don't have to go to the traditional nine-to-five anymore, like that's not really a thing. I mean it's a thing, but you don't have to.

Speaker 2: 19:20

Yeah, yeah, no, exactly I know, and I was raised by my parents. My parents were great. They were great parents, but they were very much like you have to go to college and you have to go to grad school and then you have to get a job. And I'm like I mean, fortunately I fit into that mold. I did want to be an artist for a while, so my parents are probably glad I'm not a full-time artist.

Speaker 2: 19:47

But, um, yeah, I mean, you don't have to fit into that mold. Like people have all different types of careers, they have multiple jobs, they moonlight and things. Um like nothing is really like for certain. So I think you kind of just have to put yourself out there and find what works for you. And like I've definitely thought about it before like I'm very much a night owl, so I like wouldn't it be nice if I could like work nights or work evenings and then have my days a little bit more free? And that's not about pursuing that. So maybe that's a thing I would look at in the future, in another life. But yeah, I mean, there's a lot of different options. You don't just have to follow the one linear path of like going to school and deciding your entire life before your brain is fully formed that and that was like the big thing too.

Speaker 1: 20:25

I remember like I very much was a creative when I was in grammar school and in high school and I loved just. I was very into drawing and very into like that kind of creative. And then creative writing was huge for me in high school, like I loved writing. I used to write grammar school and high school I used to write like I would get so into it and I would sit for hours and this was like back in the day, before I had a computer and I would literally I mean write like my handwriting. I would write short stories and poems and like all this stuff.

Speaker 1: 20:58

And then I got to a point when I was getting older in high school and I think it was like my junior year or senior year and it kind of the whole my parents had separated at that point and the whole reality of like life was really hitting me pretty hard because of what I was going through with my family and I was like I need to. I was observing what my parents went through and it was like I have to have a job where I am making enough money that no one will ever be able to walk away from me and leave me in dire straits. Like that was like a pivotal little Jenny moment where I think I was like 16 or 17. And I was just like screw the creative part of you, you have to make a lot of money. Like, you have to do something.

Speaker 1: 21:47

Because, honestly, like and that was like a turning point in my life because, you know, my parents separated, my dad left and my mom was a stay at home mom before that and she didn't work and so when he left, he, she had to get a job and she, she was struggling, like it was hard, and I that impacted how I treated everything and what I ended up doing. And so for me it was like go, you're going to college, because you're going to, you're going to make a lot of money, like they're going to make sure that no one can ever do to you what just happened to your mother, and that basically impacted my whole life. So it's funny it's almost full circle for me for now that now I'm leaning back into my creative part, because that's really where I wanted to always be, but I just couldn't do it. At that point in time I was like no, there's no way I can do that.

Speaker 2: 22:39

Yeah, and like that's. I mean, I think that's totally fine. Like sometimes you just have to think that way and like you're doing it now, like and I think that's really what counts is that you're. You had to do what you had to do at the time and you were a different person then and you learned and you grew and your career has changed, just like you've changed as you've aged and matured and had different experiences. So, like that's, that's really all you can do. Yeah exactly.

Speaker 1: 23:03

and it's funny because, like I um, I think I've told I think I, when I was taking these summer classes and stuff like that, about like meditation and all that stuff, I think I was telling you and our and our other friend, jen, who you've all heard on another episode, but I was telling you guys about these meditations and stuff, and like it was really through meditating and through doing I know it sounds like hippie ish, but it was through doing that that I really like kind of came back around and was like oh, I really want to go back into being creative and writing articles and like just kind of going with the flow with that kind of thing.

Speaker 2: 23:37

So I do think there's, you're right, Like there's there's, you're right, Like there's, there's like a place for it, basically kind of thing, Like I had to do what I had to do in the moment, but now I get to come back around and do this with you and, like you said, you've been doing the personal work, you've been taking classes, learning and growing and self reflecting and like that really is the key to like creating a happy life and just thinking about where you want to go in the future.

Speaker 1: 24:12

I think the self reflecting part is something to take a, take a beat on and and kind of just talk about for a minute, because I think a lot of people struggle with the self-reflection.

Speaker 1: 24:27

I think we're all really good at criticizing ourselves I'm pretty sure we all are very good at being critical of ourselves but really reflecting on, like, where you are, how you're feeling about stuff and where do you want to go from here A big thing I had started to do. I think I started doing about 14 or 15 years ago. I would do like check-ins and kind of ask myself, like am I happy? Like is this making me happy? And that sounds really like strange because you would think that in the moment you know what you're feeling. But really think about that. Like and I want the listeners to think about that too you should really be doing gut checks with yourself and say you're dating somebody, you're married, totally fine If you're single. New job, any job, whatever the case may be, whatever the situation is anything that's presented to you. Before responding, just think to yourself, like is this something I really want to do? Is this making me happy? Am I excited to do this? Does this feel like an obligation? Does this feel bad? Do I feel frustrated?

Speaker 1: 25:33

Because what I used to do many, many years ago was that I would kind of just guess everything. I was very much a I wanted to people please, and I wanted everyone to be happy and and whatever. And in doing that, though, I was really alienating myself, because everything I did was really like, oh well, so-and-so needs me to do this, and now I have to do that, now I have to do this. And I got to a point where I was like, am I doing anything for me? Like is any of this for me? And I think a lot of people miss that and they don't really realize like they're not happy because they're doing everything they feel obligated to do.

Speaker 2: 26:12

Yes, I love that you said that, because I think I went through the exact same thing, where I think as women we're socialized to be accommodating and nurturing and people pleasers and put every single person in the entire world before ourselves, even at our own detriment. And I think after a while I'm sure there's people in the world who are much more patient than I am and are still doing that to this day. But I think a lot of people get frustrated and they think like if I don't put my me first, who is going to put me first? And I think you have to do that.

Speaker 2: 26:44

And I think another point about I also kind of struggled when I first became self aware, started like working on that aspect of my life where a lot of people don't they say they don't know what they want, and that's because they become so disconnected from themselves and they haven't been listening to themselves.

Speaker 2: 26:58

And it's not their fault necessarily. It's just that like we are so socialized to pay attention to the world around us and serve others and be in service to your job and your boss and your partner and your children and things like that, and like all of those have their own place, like it's very good to put in the effort in those areas of your life, but like, if you are so open to the suggestion of other people, you will completely lose sight of what you like and what you want. And I think that can be sort of like. The first step for a lot of people is like unlearning all of the bad not bad, but I mean unlearning all of the things, the detrimental things, that sort of take them away from advocating for themselves and knowing themselves.

Speaker 2: 27:36

And I think especially for women. We are really socialized to not advocate for ourselves, to not prioritize our wants and our needs. So, as a woman, if you can just keep those in mind and make a game plan, or even just keep them in mind when you're making decisions, like you are already making a very powerful both personal statement to yourself and how you'll be treated by those around you, and also a political one.

Speaker 1: 28:04

You know it's, you'll be surprised to if, if you're listening to this and you're like, oh, you know, I haven't been feeling great about my life or I'm not happy and I don't really know what to do, or even what Abby just said, like if you're like I don, I don't know what I want to do, it's like, well, it's because you really haven't been listening to yourself. You do know what you want to do, but you're probably brushed it aside. The most interesting thing, I think, is that when you do start to make these shifts and you are only doing things that bring you joy, the amount of people that drop out of your life is astounding.

Speaker 2: 28:40

Yes, oh yeah, it's like the easiest way to get rid of people who don't have your best interest at heart or aren't even just on your team without doing any work. You don't have to do anything. You don't have to do anything. They will drop like flies.

Speaker 1: 28:56

It's crazy because you'll be able to tell within days even who really has your best interest and who really and I'm not even just talking about, like our friends, like family members. You know, I'm a big believer that just because you're a blood relative to somebody does not mean that they get a pass to treat you like crap. You know, like that for so, for so long, for like ever, it has always been like well, they're family. Oh, look the other way, they're family, like at least in my family, that's always. Oh, well, they're family, jenny, it's your family, and I'm like I don't care, like I really don't care because, at the end of the day, if you're not somebody who makes an effort to be part of my life, if you're somebody who's negative and toxic, like if you're, you know, if you have like that toxicity where I'm like I don't really want to be around you, like you take everything I say and turn it around and twist it Like I'm cool, like I'm all right. I don't need that kind of vibe in my life.

Speaker 1: 29:58

But yeah, it's wild when you do start to make these shifts for yourself, because your mother will, even you know people that you wouldn't even come out of the woodwork and be like oh my God, and start judging you and trying to push you into the direction that they're most comfortable. And really, what it is is that people who are also unhappy are going to see you making these big shifts into a positive direction and it's going to make them uncomfortable because now they're going to be seeing, well, oh, she's doing this. Like, oh well, I'm going to judge her because it's truly because doing this like oh well, I'm going to judge her because it's truly because they're probably feeling bad about themselves that they are not also making these shifts and these changes. So it's, it truly is one of those things that, like it's, the fastest way to get rid of toxic people is to just start paying attention to yourself and being yourself and advocating for yourself, and you'll see right away who really, really has your back. Like it's, it's astounding.

Speaker 2: 31:01

Yeah, exactly Like it is. I think that is kind of how I became aware of a lot of those things and like have been sort of putting the pieces together, like through therapy and like self-reflection over the past few years. Like I did kind of realize, if I do what this person wants me to do, like what about what I want and what about my happiness? Like I cannot continue to just sacrifice myself for other people. And it is kind of incredible how, when you put your own best interest first, how many people realize they cannot use you for their own personal gain and will remove themselves from their your life accordingly, which is a blessing in many ways. Like you don't want people around you who have vibes and are like secretly wishing on your downfall that's the other thing too.

Speaker 1: 31:46

Is that like it will? If you are going down that path of like you're trying to like rejigger your life and you're like I do see this and I do think I want to really start paying more attention to how I'm feeling about stuff, the first thing that's going to happen is people are going to everyone's going to push back, but you have to stand your ground and just keep checking in with yourself. Do I feel good about this decision? Am I happy deep down, like when I go to sleep, when I lay my head down on my pillow at night? Am I proud of the day that I just lived? Because that's so important and so many people are on autopilot and just going through the motions just to get through it, and why would you live your life like that? We get well. Maybe we get one chance down here right.

Speaker 1: 32:34

Depending on what you believe, because I'm on the fence. Maybe you get one shot down here. Right, and make the most of it. Don't go on autopilot. Really live your life. Don't just go through the motions. Do something that really sparks joy in you and makes you feel alive, because otherwise you're just a drone and you're just kind of going through it and like, don't do that to yourself.

Speaker 1: 32:58

You have so much more to offer and everybody you know I know that there's a lot of folks that are like actually me included. I'm very much of a person that's like I don't really have any talent, like I'm not really. I'm not talented in any particular way. Right, like that's how I feel most of the time. Like I'm not really like what are your hobbies? I'm like I don't know, like I don't really have any, but like that. That in itself is like. Also like I think a lot of people feel that way but there is nobody else on this earth. Even if you have a twin, there is nobody else on this earth Like you. You're the only person that's you. So that means you already have something unique to show the world and you need to lean into that, because that's really where you're going to find the most joy for yourself, into something great. Really lean into what's making me happy and excited and watch all of the uh, the body start to drop basically because that's what's basically going to happen?

Speaker 2: 34:06

Yeah, no, yeah, and I think that's really important. And also, at the end of the day, like you are the one living your life, you have to live with yourself and your decisions. So, you, it is most important that you are okay with it and that you are um, you are aligned with that, yeah, yeah, I think it's.

Speaker 1: 34:23

Um, it's unfortunate because I know a lot of folks, myself included, cause it's taken me a really long time to get to where I am and to be comfortable with myself and to like be comfortable as a human person and to be really, really happy. Um, it takes time. It's not an overnight thing. It takes time. But start now, start today.

Speaker 1: 34:43

If you're listening to this episode this happens every once in a while where I'll have an episode and in the episode, I have this feeling of someone's going to hear this and be like I need to make a change. And I'm saying that here now because it feels like one of those episodes and if you are hearing this, maybe it is time for a change. It can be small. Just start with that barometer of your feelings and, like, does this feel good? Like am I happy? You'll see, your life will take a whole different course With that in mind.

Speaker 1: 35:17

You mind that goes professionally and personally. Am I happy doing this? Is this okay for me? If you find yourself professionally in situations that you're consistently uncomfortable with, if you find professionally, you log off from your job or you leave your office, if you're in a live situation and you're pissed off. You're probably not at a good place, you're probably not at a place where you're supposed to be and you really need to start thinking about what that means for you and moving on from there, because the longer you stay in a place like that, the more it will change you, and the more it's going to change the kind of person you are like that, the more it will change you and the more it's going to change the kind of person you are.

Speaker 2: 35:58

Yeah, absolutely. And like, at the end of the day, like a job is just a job. Like of course, we need money to live, and like here in the United States, like our jobs are wrapped up with our health insurance, and like that is really deeply unfortunate and I'd like that to change. But like I know we spend a lot of time at work. We probably should spend a lot less time at work. But like you can just it can be a transitionary period for you. Like you can let it teach you and you can use it to like grow and self reflect and guide you into what you really want to be doing, or something that might be a better fit for you. But yeah, no, I think that's really important is like when you notice something is hardening you or making it harder to have boundaries between work and your personal life, that is like a really good indicator that something needs to change.

Speaker 1: 36:44

Yeah, exactly, I had written a very, very short article for LinkedIn and called it like living to work or working to live and our culture, working to live and our culture. We I've had the pleasure of working with folks outside of the US and our culture in the United States is, I mean, I think the only other place that's probably worse than us is like Japan or China.

Speaker 1: 37:11

I know that they're like really heavy on like work over there, um, but we basically, like our lives are sucked up by work and myself included, I've been somebody who's like I love work and I'll work 60 hours a week and you know, and I'll do all this stuff. And that only shifted for me in the last couple of years because prior to like 2019, I had no problem working all kinds of wild hours until 3am or whatever, and doing all this stuff just because I loved what I was doing so much. And it's not that I not to say that I don't love what I'm doing now, but I noticed like it pulling away from my life and like what am I doing here? Like I'm not, like I hit.

Speaker 1: 37:57

There's this quote that went around LinkedIn and it was basically like your job will replace you. If you died today, your job will have a posting you know, to replace you within like 24 hours or 48 hours. Well, your family can never get you back, your friends will never get you back. They can't replace you. And that's incredibly important for people to really recognize is that, like you're replaceable, you are just a number. Anybody can really come in and step into your shoes. Like, yes, everyone puts their own finishing touches on things, but anyone can come in and do your job. So don't kill yourself for your career, for your profession.

Speaker 2: 38:46

I know early on like it's important to really show up and really dig in, like I did that early on in my profession, but don't let it run. Your whole life is, you can always change and I mean, yeah, we've seen so many layoffs in the past year. There's so many people who thought, especially, I've seen a lot of really heartbreaking stuff on linkedin of like people who worked at places for decades and wanted to be like a lifer and then got laid off because of something completely out of their control.

Speaker 2: 39:10

Like you, just you really have to be able, willing, be able and willing to pivot um and just really have that adaptability and just being flexible yeah, it's incredibly important.

Speaker 1: 39:24

So I mean, I know we um, you know we bounced around a little bit on this episode, but I think it was all like important, impactful things. Um, you know, just kind of key takeaway, like really be mindful of what you're doing and how you're feeling about things. And I mean, if you are truly happy working loads of hours, like I mean, god bless you. But you know, try to try to do things outside of work. Is all I'm saying, abby.

Speaker 2: 39:54

Any last thoughts for our listeners um, no, I think you summarized it up really well. Um, yeah, I think definitely. Uh, pinterest one of my suggestions in your for your show notes is that pinterest has a lot of really good like journaling, suggestions for just like working on self-reflection and, um, like different prompts on like work and how to become closer to the person you want to become, and things like that. So those have been really helpful and really useful for me, yeah.

Speaker 1: 40:27

That's a really interesting tip. I would have never picked up. I would have never known that, because Pinterest is like oh yeah.

Speaker 2: 40:32

I can send you some if you want. I have like a. I love Pinterest. I have so many boards. Oh my God, no, I. You know what I?

Speaker 1: 40:36

I'll send you some if you want. I have like a. I love Pinterest. I have so many boards. Oh my god, no, I, you know what. I I'll send you like my, my name or whatever on there, whatever so you can find me. But yeah, like I, I'm on there all the time, but I'm always on there for like recipes and like clothes.

Speaker 1: 40:47

So like yeah um, I hope you all found um this episode um informative. I hope you found it insightful and, you know, I hope you do take something away from it that will better your life and help you to live a more authentic life and show up as authentically you. Abby, thank you for joining me for this episode. I really appreciate it. I know we tried a couple times to record and this is like we finally did it, so I'm excited.

Speaker 2: 41:20

Yes, me too. Thank you so much. I had so much fun Excellent.

Speaker 1: 41:25

Well, thank you everybody for listening. Stay tuned for next week's episode and we'll talk to you then. Have a good night.